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Travelling Light...........

Discussion in 'Equipment' started by Brownbear, Jun 26, 2017.

  1. Brownbear

    Brownbear Active Member

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    The subject of post fall vehicles has come up and, to provide balance, here are some thoughts on travelling light.

    Pros: if you can't carry it do you really need it? I would argue no, you probably don't. If you look at soldiers pre mechanisation (for example Napoleonic times) supply chains were notoriously unreliable and most average foot soldiers carried what needed and foraged the rest. Hedgerow food is easily available and abundant during the "growing" season. In the UK water shortages are never going to be an issue. Shelter is easily constructed or acquired. I would therefore argue that four three out of four seasons living as an itinerant has many advantages.

    Cons: If you have little each item takes on slightly more importance than if you have many items. A broken axe haft could be a real problem. If you are a shooter and travel light your ammo would be restricted by weight. You would also have to be reasonably self disciplined, make shelter and fire each day as priority etc.

    Anybody got any thoughts on this?
     
    Keith likes this.
  2. lonewolf

    lonewolf Administrator Staff Member

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    I've done a lot of backpacking-as it was once called- on Dartmoor, and never found the pack that heavy, if one had access to woods one could dispense with a tent and a stove this would make the pack even lighter.
    as BB says water in the uk shouldn't be a problem, we have enough rain in the South West!
    one thing some might find useful is a wooden staff, I have several, these will be useful for crossing rivers and on uneven ground.
     
  3. Prime

    Prime Well-Known Member

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    My thoughts

    Yes you can travel light and fast and yes the visual and noise profile you provide will be far less - ideal for scouting and CTR work maybe and there are a lot of overlap with military tactics for why.

    But - a Vehicle supplies and immediate ability to increase logistical self-reliance and operational area , even if you choose to leave it parked up for days at a time whilst you scout the area on foot it provides many many advantages.

    Yes carrying kit is possible and loads of Infantry men will fight , move and live from their backpack for weeks at a time - they also have the ability to resupply from an advanced logistal support chain. Even the famous Sealous Scouts who were renowned for their 'bush living' skills had Heli supply and evac support.

    If the response is going to be , Yes a Car/Truck/Bike is fine but the fuel will run out then I'd say this is an empty logic - Yes at some point the Fuel WILL run out but I can assure that physcically one is going to be in better SURVIVAL SHAPE ( ie protection of calories ) then opposed to tabbing/yomping all day long - yes you will get fit and yes its important to have long distance legs ready but if you are moving everyday you'll get road weary.

    And we are talking about a Post Event situation - personally speaking I'd want Two of everything i think i may need ( and i've seen that quoted by others here - LW ) Well , that inbuilt redundacy of having multiple items costs in terms of size and weight.

    So yes , I say a vehicle is something you would benefit from - can you get by with out it?? for sure!!! But are your chances of long term survival enhanced with using it as a mother vehicle?? Yes.
     
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  4. Brownbear

    Brownbear Active Member

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    I don't know why you think one would be tabbing/yomping all day long? People survived just fine for a very long time before the invention of the internal combustion engine - that any of us are here proves that without a doubt.
     
  5. lonewolf

    lonewolf Administrator Staff Member

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    before the invention of the motor car people didn't feel the need to go long distances, I know people that -apart from serving in the war- haven't gone further than the cottage down the road when they got married, or a mile or so to the weekly market, there wasn't this great compunction to travel long distances, people were quite happy where they were.
     
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  6. Brownbear

    Brownbear Active Member

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    Which was no bad thing really - these days we travel with impunity, but travel is fraught with danger (road accidents etc) and high costs that we simply accept but perhaps shouldn't
     
  7. lonewolf

    lonewolf Administrator Staff Member

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    post SHTF it will probably go back to that, I see no need-once people have bugged out- to go travelling long distances, there will be enough to do back at base to put food on the table, there wont be the time or I suspect the need to go trapsing long distances, and such would be fraught with danger anyway.
     
  8. Brownbear

    Brownbear Active Member

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    There are also advantages to living within a limited from a health point of view. Post SHTF modern medicine will quickly become obsolete (through lack of availability rather than knowledge) and the door will be wide open for a pandemic that could pre SHTF be controlled.
     
  9. lonewolf

    lonewolf Administrator Staff Member

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    in the case of a pandemic isolation will be the key, most diseases have to have a human host and jump from person to person, if there are no new hosts for it to jump to it wont live long outside of a human body.
     
  10. Prime

    Prime Well-Known Member

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    Well , that would depend a lot upon the mystery event wouldn't it? I don't see some sort of rapture type event happening where the social situation is reset over night. And during that period of change - post fall I see a vehicle as a pretty key asset - yes long term historical survival many people managed and succeeded with no motorised vehicle but by god did they use animal power a lot more , and after animal power they chose to use motorised vehicles.
     
  11. ystranc

    ystranc Well-Known Member

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    *people have been travelling huge distances since the Neolithic period following game or exploiting seasonal resources Many stayed put once they'd adopted an agricultural lifestyle but that would come much later, plenty still migrated following prey animals up until the late 19th century.
    *Trained pack animals are not exactly common here in the UK and unless you are an expert horseman training one while actually working it in a post apocalyptic world would be a none starter. However most people can ride a bike or drive a car. (I know more than most people do about horses but nowhere near enough)
    *in other posts it has been suggested that travelling at night would be preferable but that also makes it easy to get "bushed" and damned difficult to properly exploit any resources that are along your route. I would suggest that travelling by day is safer unless you are actually taking part in a military op. or trying to evade someone.
    *As far as travelling light, yes totally I totally agree that there is no point in carrying more than you need to but there is an assumption that you're travelling alone. If your companions are similarly equipped then you have more than enough duplication of equipment without each person carrying spares. Larger loads can be split between the group
    *Aborigional people all over the world have been leaving cashed supplies along migration routes against a time of need. There is no reason not to do so for yourselves if you have a route planned.
     
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  12. lonewolf

    lonewolf Administrator Staff Member

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    i've already stated my preferred time of travel, 1 hr before and 1 hour after dawn and the same at dusk, and hiding up during the main hours of daylight, movement will be seen too easily by persons we don't want to see us and the results could be fatal.
    fuel wont be available for long once the collapse happens, filling stations will be quickly emptied by the panicking many and wont be resupplied, so alternative means of travel will have to be found.
    Aboriginal and native peoples were all hunter gatherers and carried with them what they needed, in the case of aboriginal or stone age peoples this wasn't very much.
     
  13. ystranc

    ystranc Well-Known Member

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    Very true LoneWolf, in the case of the aboriginal Australians, I have never heard of a people who's lives were so pared down and free from material goods.
     
  14. lonewolf

    lonewolf Administrator Staff Member

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    they found what they wanted in the wild, their skills and knowledge gave them everything they needed.
     
  15. Brownbear

    Brownbear Active Member

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    In historically choosing to use motorised vehicles one should be mindful of military development during WW1 when armies moved to motorised transport for reasons on practicality (principally the allies as most mules were supplied by the US and the German submarine fleet were sinking a lot of US transports and, hence, there was a shortage of mules and horses).

    In terms of individual survival and movement travelling by foot has proved adequate for far longer than motorised transport of any form has existed. I suggest that shows there to be a good case for pedestrian movement.
     
  16. lonewolf

    lonewolf Administrator Staff Member

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    in a post collapse environment where some form of government or military still exists, you can forget about motorways and main A roads, there was a plan devised in the 70s and 80s and to my knowledge it hasn't been scrapped-probably cos it makes sense, to ban all civilian traffic from these roads, that means not only motor vehicles but bicycles and even pedestrians, these are classified as ESR's or Essential Service Routes and to allow only Fire service, Medical and Military use. you will have to use minor county roads or better still get off the roads completely.
     
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  17. Keith

    Keith Moderator Staff Member

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    No argument from me regarding travelling light, but it takes some experience to sort out the needs from the wants. Most, if not all that we carry is for comfort, ease of living. We (skilled people) could survive with no gear at all, but that sort of life is not very pleasant or comfortable. After one gets some primitive things made, life gets a little easier, but it is still far from ideal. So, we carry what we need to make our life in the wilderness bearable, in some cases this may mean carrying some weight, especially when we start on the trek & we are carrying a good supply of dried foods, & in my case plenty of water.
    But for people as old as myself, with arthritis, old injuries etc, we have to get that weight down as much as we can. We move slow anyway, more weight slows us further & one wrong step with a heavy pack can cause more injuries. So yes, we all should be thinking "sustainable" & "self-reliant". I will add my latest video to give you something to think about in regards to guns & ammo when bugging out.
    Keith.
     
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  18. lonewolf

    lonewolf Administrator Staff Member

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    it also varies on the terrain one is travelling across, I spent a lot of time walking across Dartmoor which is mostly a treeless moorland so a tarp would be useless without anything to attach it to, so a tent becomes a necessity, camp fires are banned because of the chance of setting the peat alight so some form of stove is required.
     
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